mf - story #5267 - I got it from DSK.

posted by Nylorac on October 4th, 2009 at 8:01PM

I got it from DSK. Where else? =)

I completely agree about the libertarian and anarchist diagrams. They *could* work for some people, but it's not so uniformly agreed upon that that's how they're seen. By far, the capitalist and socialist diagrams are the best - spot on, and funny.

My favourite is socialism described by capitalists. "Fuck you, you thief!" Well, that's how I interpret it. There was no consensus on the interpretation.

Link | Parent

posted by dennisn on October 4th, 2009 at 8:21PM

Your interpretation of the soc-described-by-caps diagram is exactly correct. How do you figure it's open to different interpretation?

Link

posted by Nylorac on October 4th, 2009 at 8:45PM

Well, I don't. But I showed this image to a lot of people, and got some other interpretations ... that I didn't agree with, so I didn't remember them.

Link

posted by dennisn on October 4th, 2009 at 8:26PM

The depiction of capitalism by socialists is misleading. If they mean the gun is state regulation and corporate-subsidy (corporatism), then sure. But if they mean "denying terrible-propagandized-state-education" is the same as holding a gun to one's head -- that's simply wrong. I guess this kills the joke, but that's reality.

Link

posted by Nylorac on October 4th, 2009 at 8:44PM

>>"denying terrible-propagandized-state-education" is the same as holding a gun to one's head -- that's simply wrong

Yeah, that can't possibly be it.

I want to take the gun as symbolism of the simple unwillingness of the capitalist to share, and the negative view that a socialist would have with that.

Link

posted by dennisn on October 4th, 2009 at 9:00PM

That's what I meant -- they think unwillingness to share is the same thing as holding a gun to someone's head -- and that's their fucked up rationalization for picking up REAL guns and forcing others to share. They invent imaginary poetic guns to justify their real guns. At least state-capitalists (ie. dictators) are honest and consistent. Ugh.

Link

posted by dennisn on October 4th, 2009 at 8:18PM

What would your diagram for social organization be?

Link

posted by Nylorac on October 4th, 2009 at 8:46PM

I can't answer yet because I'm not sure what you're asking for. Do you mean for libertarianism and below? all of them? or something else?

Link

posted by dennisn on October 4th, 2009 at 9:17PM

I guess my question was misleading. OBVIOUSLY you wouldn't (admit to) want a diagram in which a gun is pointed at someone's head. And I guess, in that sense, the diagram does serve a purpose -- ridiculing the gun. Nevertheless, once one points out the gun (the forceful stealing of money from other people, be it for your own defense contractors, or for your own education or healthcare), surely you can no longer support that? (And we agree on the objectivity of the gun, right? Ie. not sharing is NOT the same thing as holding a gun to someone's head, right? (Except in the extreme Proudhonian sense in which a super-evil-monopolist owns all the land, and somehow manages to bring all the others to the brink of starvation, clamouring at the gates of his compound.))

Link

posted by Nylorac on October 4th, 2009 at 9:21PM

(just wanted to let you know that i have to stop posting tonight because i have a paper to write for History of Physics, but that i will respond tomorrow while i'm at work. haha.)

Link